Kids these days...

Well, I was playing in a 2x1 versus some dudes and nothing was going wrong. No one complaining, no one was leaving and joining and they both seemed to know what they were doing for the most part. However, DarkDwarf decided to be a total jackass and kill the game for apparently no reason.

[10:22p] <Sticks> pawnybot lock 27503
[10:22p] <PawnyBot> The game on port 27503 is now server locked.
...
[10:29p] <DarkDwarf> srry sticks it just cant go on
[10:29p] <DarkDwarf> pawnybot lock 27503
[10:29p] <PawnyBot> The game on port 27503 is now server locked.
[10:29p] <DarkDwarf> pawnybot kill 27503
[10:29p] <PawnyBot> ack! ya got me! DarkDwarf just killed port 27503 on Pawnybot.winbolo.us
[10:29p] <Sticks> WTF
[10:29p] <Sticks> you jackass
[10:29p] <Sticks> why did you do that?
[10:30p] <Sticks> can someone please at least kick this dumbfuck
-
DarkDwarf is wbb@ip68-102-155-82.ks.ok.cox.net * wbb
DarkDwarf is a registered nick
DarkDwarf on #bolo #winbolo
DarkDwarf using irc.winbolo.us
DarkDwarf End of /WHOIS list.
-
[10:30p] <DarkDwarf> done
[10:30p] * DarkDwarf (wbb@ip68-102-155-82.ks.ok.cox.net) Quit (Quit: Sorry Sticks)

Apparently, he thought I killed one of his earlier games on sheepbot.. here's the log between us..

[10:32p] <DDbot> It just cant go on
[10:32p] <Sticks> wtf?
[10:32p] <Sticks> why?
[10:32p] <Sticks> like.. you're a noob
[10:32p] <Sticks> a nobody
[10:32p] <Sticks> I've never even talked to you
[10:32p] <Sticks> so what the fuck is up you piece of trash?
[10:32p] <DDbot> THE FUCKASS KILLED MY GAME
[10:32p] <DDbot> YOU
[10:32p] <Sticks> what game?
[10:33p] <DDbot> YOU
[10:33p] <DDbot> YOU
[10:33p] <Sticks> what game?
[10:33p] <DDbot> King of islands 2
[10:33p] <Sticks> I didn't kill that game you moron
[10:34p] <Sticks> yeah, exactly
[10:34p] <Sticks> think before you do stupid shit next time
[10:34p] <DDbot> Y did it say <sticks> Sheepbot kill ___
[10:34p] <Sticks> when?
[10:34p] <DDbot> i dunno
[10:34p] <Sticks> damn right you don't know
[10:34p] <DDbot> its gone from mine
[10:34p] <Sticks> 'coz you're making shit up
[10:34p] <DDbot> SORRY
[10:34p] <Sticks> piece of shit
[10:34p] <Sticks> go back to grade school
[10:34p] <Sticks> learn how to play with others
[10:34p] <Sticks> and learn how to read nicknames
[10:34p] <Sticks> and get your facts straight
[10:34p] <DDbot> U FUCKASS
[10:35p] <DDbot> UR A ADULT PLAYING A KID GAME
[10:35p] <DDbot> sorry
[10:35p] <DDbot> it was
[10:35p] <DDbot> STI somethin
[10:35p] <Sticks> goddammit kid
[10:35p] <Sticks> I swear
[10:35p] <DDbot> SORRY
[10:36p] <DDbot> NOW
[10:36p] <DDbot> PISS OFF

Was I a little harsh on the kid? Maybe, but he needs to learn to actually think before he does stuff that affects other people. For one, revenge isn't cool. Killing that game did not affect just me but two other participants.

why is your sig a link to a pic of graffitti?

That's trogdor the burninator? Btw, damn that lil' fucker

DD, even IF sticks had killed your game (which is not clear that he did), you should not even think about revenge game killing. Doing stuff like that can get you banned from irc and the game bots, so don't do it again.

After this incident last night, I explained to DarkDwarf that further killing games like that would lead him to be banned.

As for Sticks killing a game - it is my understanding from people in the channel when it happened, Sticks did kill a game in which DarkDwarf was playing. However, someone else in the game did ask for that game to be killed.

Anyway, let's all be clear and carefull here people. Killing a game should be used only when noone is playing it - or by the person who started the map.

i asked it to be killed...the allies were fucked cause some bitch allied every1...

Madd Maxx wrote:

That's trogdor the burninator? Btw, damn that lil' fucker

tping and egging is more fun that graffiti ing :P

sheeps wrote:

DD, even IF sticks had killed your game (which is not clear that he did), you should not even think about revenge game killing. Doing stuff like that can get you banned from irc and the game bots, so don't do it again.

Or to put it simpler, two wrongs don't make a right.

FireIce, can you please post the log of the game I killed on sheepbot? I don't kill games unless there's a reason.

Here's what I've found within the past week:

[4:19a] <Sticks> sheepbot map seefeel
[4:19a] <sheepbot> Seefeel.map @ winbolo://sheeps.winbolo.us:62142 - strict - password: frozenchops
[4:20a] <Sticks> damn
[4:21a] <Sticks> gotta reupload it
[4:22a] <Sticks> sheepbot kill 62142
[4:22a] <sheepbot> ack! ya got me! Sticks just killed port 62142 on sheeps.winbolo.us


That was on Sunday, February 8th, 2004. This next entry was on Tuesday, February 3rd, 2004.

[9:15p] <Sinister> sheepbot map jonny
[9:15p] <sheepbot> JonnyWar I.map @ winbolo://sheeps.winbolo.us:62113 - strict - password: frozenchops
[9:18p] <Senzuri> join jonny spin and roc
[9:18p] <Senzuri> and ren
[9:18p] <Senzuri> 2 more
[9:18p] <Senzuri> now 1 more in jonny
[9:19p] <Senzuri> ren join
[9:23p] <Sinister> kill it spin
[9:23p] <Spintega> sheepbot kill 62113
[9:23p] <sheepbot> ack! ya got me! Spintega just killed port 62113 on sheeps.winbolo.us

These were the only two instances of me or someone with a nick similar enough to mine killing a game. Could it be that I was somehow confused with Spintega? God, I hope not.

After going thru my irc.winbolo.us logs for the past 2 months, I noticed that I did kill more than a few pawnybot games but those I did only after I joined them and checked 'em out. There seems to be a couple glitches for ports 27503 and 27507. I had killed no renbot games and no other sheepbot games.

So unless I'm overlooking some hidden logs or DarkDwarf didn't complain immediately after I killed a game on pawnybot (unlikely), I think you need to do more research instead asking a couple of questions and then assuming what happened, FireIce.

quite honestly, this is what happens when no forththought goes into the creation of gamebots .... I put a hell of alot of effort into minbot, and one of the things I did, was built a function that closed all open games with no players in them, why did I spend time building this function? ... so that this sort of thing didn't happen, minbot only killed games that noone was in (except for one hidden function that only I could use in the event that for some reason he malfunctioned badly.) The only other time minbot killed games that had players in them was when he ran out of Harddrive space. perhaps sheeps should go back to the drawing board on this one. Allowing anyone who comes along to kill games is a very bad idea, I've been playing numerous open games on renbot lately (assuming renbot is using sheeps code) and the moment someone started to lose, the game would quit. I have no idea weither this is becuase someone was killing it ... or what .... but it happened about 6-7 times in a row before I threatened to tear out someone's liver if it happened again .... after that it didn't happen again .... This sort of behavior is not only predictable, but expected. Why are we not putting in the effort to predict this sort of thing beforehand?

Min

Perhaps they were thinking that if we let everyone kill games, but only do it in the channel, the offender will be easily caught and punished. There are some expceptions, however.

1) Ops just don't punish the offender for whatever reason. One form would be a kban for a certain amount of time or having the bot owner place the offender on ignore for a certain amount of time.

2) It was the bot owner killing his own games. In this case, you can't do a damn thing about it. What you can do is learn not to play on their server or run your own open games. However, this becomes a problem when the bot owner has no other competition, ie. his bot is the only server available in #winbolo.

As for reasons why, perhaps it was too hard to implement. Perhaps they just don't have the forsight that you and others do.

Sticks wrote:

Perhaps they were thinking that if we let everyone kill games, but only do it in the channel, the offender will be easily caught and punished. There are some expceptions, however.

ya, but they make the rule only kill games when noone is in them ...... why not just program that little rule right in ... therefore there is no punishment becuase noone can not follow the rules.

Sticks wrote:

1) Ops just don't punish the offender for whatever reason. One form would be a kban for a certain amount of time or having the bot owner place the offender on ignore for a certain amount of time.

op's can't be expected to deal with every situation that may warrant a kban, its better to simply idiot proof the stuff you code so that you don't have to punish people for not following the "rules" becuase the bot itself enforces the rules.

Sticks wrote:

2) It was the bot owner killing his own games. In this case, you can't do a damn thing about it. What you can do is learn not to play on their server or run your own open games. However, this becomes a problem when the bot owner has no other competition, ie. his bot is the only server available in #winbolo.

pretty sure it wasn't ... and currently most bot owners are mature enough to realize how bad of a reaming they would recieve for pulling crap like that.

Sticks wrote:

As for reasons why, perhaps it was too hard to implement. Perhaps they just don't have the forsight that you and others do.

maybe. I thought the implementation itself was fairly easy, but it just took time to code. considering the maturity of this community, you'd think this sort of thing would get more thought.

Min

Min wrote:

ya, but they make the rule only kill games when noone is in them ...... why not just program that little rule right in ... therefore there is no punishment becuase noone can not follow the rules.

Well, this is the first I have heard that minbot only killed games that were empty.

Min wrote:

Sticks wrote:

As for reasons why, perhaps it was too hard to implement. Perhaps they just don't have the forsight that you and others do.

maybe. I thought the implementation itself was fairly easy, but it just took time to code. considering the maturity of this community, you'd think this sort of thing would get more thought.
Min

Or maybe it was better to have a game bot developed instead of having no game bots. Frankly, I think it is better to have something and then improve it or sit and think of all the ways to deal with noobs.

And frankly, I don't see this as such a major problem that it can't be dealt with with the current rules until something is built into the spawner.

Oh, and if you don't like what's out there, feel free to release something better. The whole game bot and spawner are open source, so go nuts.

I have 2 main ideas and some variations for the game problem:

1. Build a logger into the bot so that all bot events (i.e. game , making, locking) are logged into a file so that players can see how the bot was used.
1. Make the bot alert the ops that someone has killed or locked the a game, so they can look back in their logs when they notice it to see
if it was justified.


2. Make it so that it is possible to set the players who are allowed to lock, unlock, and kill the game. A person would set these when they made the games, and would type in the nicks. To prevent other people taking those nicks and affecting the game, the bot could take note of the ip those nicks have at the time of the game being made.

Min wrote:

Allowing anyone who comes along to kill games is a very bad idea. Min

Aye.

Btw, what happened to minbot? I'm not caught up on the winbolo community history yet. How laggy was it? How long did it operate? Why is it not here now?

Q-mandabomb wrote:

i asked it to be killed...the allies were fucked cause some bitch allied every1...

Maybe I'm missing something, but why would you ever need to ask anyone to kill a game for you? You could do it yourself unless the bot is ignoring you, but if it's ignoring you, you presumably wouldn't be in that game anyway and wouldn't care.

sheeps wrote:

DD, even IF sticks had killed your game (which is not clear that he did), you should not even think about revenge game killing. Doing stuff like that can get you banned from irc and the game bots, so don't do it again.

Ya I figured that out

i have a really short temper and get in trouble a lot(no this is no excuse call my P.E. teacher)i act before i think a lot thats y my mom and dad ban me from the Computer.
Sticks im sorry i ruined your game it musta been under or over the person that killed my game
like


<____>____bot kill _____
<sticks>__________


Srry sticks


;-(


-DD

(ban me if ya wanna)

Kax wrote:

Q-mandabomb wrote:

i asked it to be killed...the allies were fucked cause some bitch allied every1...

Maybe I'm missing something, but why would you ever need to ask anyone to kill a game for you? You could do it yourself unless the bot is ignoring you, but if it's ignoring you, you presumably wouldn't be in that game anyway and wouldn't care.

because im too lazy to type /join #winbolo , then go find what port the game is on, then type to kill it. i didnt actually say "joe, kill this" i said "new game, end this, its fucked." who would want to play a game with every1 allied anyway? besides newbs?

sheeps wrote:

Well, this is the first I have heard that minbot only killed games that were empty.

He also spit out various information about the games you played on him, such as how many lgm's where killed, you could get specific stats such as if you were just in a game and want to know how many lgm's you killed .. he'd give you that info. irc.winbolo.com is back up ... and minbot is running on it .. as of this writing ... feel free to go type /msg minbot help

sheeps wrote:

Or maybe it was better to have a game bot developed instead of having no game bots. Frankly, I think it is better to have something and then improve it or sit and think of all the ways to deal with noobs.

strange, I offered minbot to anyone who asked, and I asked sj to build a mirc bot so people who wanted to run one could ... its really not my fault noone was interested until recently.

sheeps wrote:

And frankly, I don't see this as such a major problem that it can't be dealt with with the current rules until something is built into the spawner.

sure, but quite honestly, with a bit of effort, it wouldn't have to be dealt with at all ... wouldn't that be better?

sheeps wrote:

Oh, and if you don't like what's out there, feel free to release something better. The whole game bot and spawner are open source, so go nuts.

you know as well as I that I already have all of this crap programmed. And if I didn't I wouldn't use someone else's code anyways .... I'd program my own from scratch. but just like my skin, noone is interested enough, and why do work when I can simply make note of problems I see and other people (such as yourself) can go about changing them ... if they desire ......... or they could just go on ignoring me ........ which is more likely to occur.

Min

p.s. I'm not saying your bot is crap or anything, just suggesting more thought could be put into some of the particular features.

Acro wrote:

Btw, what happened to minbot? I'm not caught up on the winbolo community history yet. How laggy was it? How long did it operate? Why is it not here now?

nothing "happened" to him ... he's currently sitting on irc.winbolo.com happily serviing any games people ask him too.

Minbot has always been fairly laggy, he is hosted on the same server that hosts irc.winbolo.com, and the same server that hosts the tracker. due to the high usage that server gets for other things (webhosting) by the fellow who owns it, he's always had issues with lag ... which is why noone uses him even though his features are superior. Minbot was in development for quite some time, but was officially used as the major gamebot when 1.10 was released which was 21/2/02. he's very stable, and works well, his only issues are harddrive space(which means he can't update his configuration files) and lag.

Min

DarkDwarf wrote:

Srry sticks


;-(


-DD

Apology accepted. Now just think before you do stuff from now on, ok?

sticks..... stfu and stop whinning, you are worse then indiana... and that is hard to beat.

Thnks sticks